Preparing executives to speak to the media is a vital part of a PR pro’s job. After all, executives should be ready to speak to reporters in planned interviews as well as in moments when they may be caught off guard.
Far too often these days, we see stories about executives who may have misspoken—and the clips can go viral. (Anyone recall when the CEO of Kellogg’s suggested families struggling with food costs eat cereal for dinner? 😳)
The good news is that, with some preparation, spokespeople can feel confident answering questions and incorporating key messages into any communication with the media.
My guest is Joel Schwartzberg, workplace communications and presentation coach, keynote speaker, executive communications professional, and author of “Get to the Point!”.
Show summary:
In this episode of PR Explored, host Michelle Garrett invites communications and presentations coach Joel Schwartzberg to discuss key message development and the importance of media training for executives. Joel shares his approach to executive communication, emphasizing the importance of having a clear and compelling point, and offers practical tips on how to effectively convey messages to a reporter’s audience. The conversation covers techniques such as the primacy and recency effects, bridging off-topic questions back to key messages, and the importance of making messages simple yet impactful. The episode concludes with recommendations for tailoring communication styles to different mediums without altering the core message, solidifying the idea that preparation and practice can turn anyone into a confident spokesperson.
00:00 Welcome to PR Explored
00:17 Meet Joel Swartzberg
01:29 The Importance of Key Messages
04:17 Effective Communication Strategies
07:55 Crafting Strong Key Messages
21:39 Bridging Off-Point Questions
30:52 The Pitfalls of Overloading Information
32:04 Prioritizing Key Messages
34:21 Effective Storytelling in Media
37:31 Handling Off-the-Cuff Remarks
41:04 The Importance of Media Training
42:45 Crafting Authentic Email Interviews
47:26 Defining Technical Terms for Impact
49:43 The Power of Practice and Feedback
54:50 Adapting to Different Media Channels
58:55 Conclusion and Upcoming Topics
Show notes:
Learn more about Joel Schwartzberg and his services: https://www.joelschwartzberg.net/
Follow Joel Schwartzberg on LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/joelschwartzberg
Full transcript:
Media training advice for better executive communications
Michelle: [00:00:00] Hello everyone and welcome to PR Explored. I’m so happy to be here today. PR Explored is the video podcast where we delve into trends and topics related to public relations. I’m Michelle Garrett. I’m your host. I’m a PR consultant, author and writer, and I’m excited to have my guest today, Joel Swartzberg.
Welcome, Joel.
Joel: Thank you so much, Michelle. It’s really an honor and a pleasure to be here with your audience and like we were discussing earlier to meet you somewhat in person. If not IRL, then at least face-to-face and live. You and I go back a number of years. I think we met on X originally. I think so,
Michelle: and we have known each other for a long time and I have a lot of respect for you.
I know that, you’re an expert in your space and you’re an author and I really, exci, I’m excited that you were able to do this today and I’m happy that we’re, [00:01:00] we’re talking.
Joel: I’m excited too. Mic.
Michelle: And why don’t you, I, I can read a, your introduction.
I know that you’re a communications and presentations coach. You’re a keynote speaker, and you’re the author of Get To The Point. but why don’t you tell us, a little bit more about you and your work, anything that you’d like to share, and then we’ll get started.
Joel Schwartzberg’s background
Joel: Sure. probably the most relevant thing is I spent 10 years until, 2024.
I worked in executive communications and that overlapped so much with PR because our CEO needed to have quotes and press releases, was going out on interviews, was going on TV shows, was giving speeches where reporters were present, and I really enjoyed that specific challenge of. Reaching the public through the media and the ways [00:02:00] to do that, and the many ways to do that, especially with all the platforms, we have now.
So I’ve given a lot of thought to that. And in fact, we developed a media training, workshop. A class that took the best of what I do, which is public speaking training or what I like to call, workplace communication training and apply that to media training. So you have an executive who not only presents effectively, understands their point.
But understands their point as a key message, as we like to say in pr. that goes out to reporters. Now, my background in communication goes way back to sixth grade when I did, speech and debate competition. We won’t go back that far. but I will say that at one point I had a huge aha moment. And I was talking to executives and clients and students, and I would just happen to ask them, Hey, when you go out to that meeting with a reporter or when you’re [00:03:00] giving that speech, what’s your point?
Just so I know, what’s your, let’s call it a key message here. What’s your key message? Just so we’re on the same page. And Michelle, they wouldn’t know. They would have themes, they would have topics, they would have notions, observations, categories, catchphrases, but they wouldn’t have a point. And that’s when I changed the trajectory of all my training to this idea of, what is your point?
do you know it, is it strong? Is it sharp? Is it memorable? Is it compelling? Because if you don’t have that your point, then everything else is pointless. You have icing but no cake. so that’s the psychology I used when I work in executive communications. And I put that together in this book called Get to the Point.
yeah, Now in its second edition. and that’s a. It’s a short book because my publisher told me if I can’t make my point in under 20,000 words, then I’m like a dentist with [00:04:00] bad teeth. I need to walk the walk and talk the talk. So it’s really those ideas that apply so well and so vitally, to PR settings.
Executives need to be prepared to speak on the fly
Michelle: No, I, absolutely agree. And I feel like we see, I think. We’re talking about, how to improve, executive communications and how to get executives ready and prepared, because I think times have changed a lot for executives, as far as being put on the spot now.
And, used to be, you would schedule an interview and you would have time to prepare and think about it, and then it just, it’s just a different world now because they’re out at events. Reporters are there, they ask a question, they get caught off guard. Sometimes they’re just. Like they, they’re like a deer in the headlights or they just.
Start talking and who knows what’s gonna come out, so this is why, you can’t, obviously, if you have a, an [00:05:00] executive that’s a great spokesperson, you, it’s a real boost to the PR program because, you don’t wanna be cleaning up a mess based on the fact that somebody spoke without really.
Being prepared or thinking first. And I think the more they can work through some of these things ahead of time, the more likely they’re going to, the less likely they’re gonna put their foot in their mouth at the wrong time.
Joel: Executives are often, they often come to the table with certain problems that I find not to throw lawyers under the bus, but lawyers often have this problem too, which is because I know.
Everything. Therefore, ergo I can communicate it effectively. And those are two very different things. In fact, I don’t even like to use the word spokesperson when I talk to CEOs because that gets them in the mindset of, alright, what did my PR team tell me? What are the key messages? What’s the, the, building blocks that I need to regurgitate?[00:06:00]
In this setting, they need to be strong communicators, and that means everything you said, plus listening, understanding the question and learning how to make their points within the context Of answering that question. And you’re right, sometimes it’s live, sometimes there are gotcha questions.
sometimes you can over prepare. Yep. I’ve seen that a lot of, CEOs being over prepared and very. destructive ways, and that are at the very least waste time. If you really understand what’s happening between that CEO or that executive and the reporter, there are things you just don’t need to do.
and there are things you do need to do, and people, especially media relations teams need to understand that.
Michelle: Yeah. so there’s, I, have so many thoughts.
Joel: You were like, so prompted to like, deliver, please just stop doing [00:07:00] that and do this instead. Yeah.
Michelle: I, and I don’t want to jump ahead, but I think sometimes it’s just like even taking a breath and thinking through, you know what it is.
That they wanna say, because I think sometimes they feel put on the spot and they, again, just the preparation and the, that can really help so much. And you’re preparing for something that may never happen honestly. you can’t, I think you can’t ever prepare, but you also, I think it’s more common that they under prepare.
let’s just get into our questions. Okay. A little bit. we, again, we could talk all afternoon, I’m sure, but, and I wanna encourage anybody listening or watching to ask questions too. We’re happy to, take those. I’m sure Joel will be glad to take questions, Absolutely.
What makes a strong key message?
let’s talk first about, what makes a strong key [00:08:00] message. Let’s talk about that.
Joel: Sure. Now this dovetails with my training about point. So for those of you in, PR and who do it well, you understand that a strong key message is the, biggest takeaway for that reporter, that reporter will deliver to the audience.
So if you work for 150 year old organization and that organization is saving lives, you don’t want to be quoted as saying, this is 150 year old organization. You want to be quoted as saying, this is the organization that saved lives. So it’s really the one idea, and usually I’m gonna say it’s the one.
Idea, that you most want to appear as the quote, that appears or as the thing that’s remembered because you’ve repeated it. Now, a strong key message reflects your purpose and your mission, not your personality or yourself. for some executives, it’s important to reinforce their [00:09:00] reputation, but I would say that’s secondary.
the first. priority is articulating what your business does to improve the lives of people. Even if you’re selling Coca-Cola, even if you’re in technology, what I’ve often found is that, and this gets into the needles a little bit, but I say in my training there are key messages that say, this will make this policy better or this will allow us to create more buildings.
But what I found is that when you end a strong message on an impact on living things, people, animals, society, patients, clients. It’s more compelling to people. So ask, what is your impact on a human being or an animal Plant life? Not so much. and people are more interested now. I wasn’t satisfied with that answer [00:10:00] myself.
It’s fuzzy. All right. I get it. So when get to the point, if you don’t mind my saying, there are two exercises. They’re so simple that I share the same thing with the third and fourth and fifth graders that I teach to help you turn a topic into a key message. The first is called the, I believe that test you take what you think is your key message.
So this will be one sentence you put the words. I believe that in front of it. And you ask yourself one question, is this now a complete sentence? Would this impress my fourth grade language arts teacher as a complete sentence and not a fragment and not a run-on? And that’s how you get from something like, I’m gonna talk today about podcasting, so let’s apply the test.
I believe that podcasting not a complete sentence. I believe that the value of podcasting. Not a complete sentence. I believe that the evolution of podcasting, not a complete sentence, it forces you to say something like, I’m gonna talk to you today about how podcasting enables you to [00:11:00] reach millennial audiences better than other avenues.
Now that’s a complete sentence, but it makes a reporter go, tell me more. Go on. Because you’re, you have a mechanism for change and an impact for change. And that’s the second test, which is just as easy. It’s called the XY test. And the XY test says, here’s your template for a key, message.
If we do x. Y the letter Y will result, or doing X will result in Y. So X is the mechanism like podcasting. Y is the impact like reaching a millennial audience. If you want a strong key message, it’ll have both elements. So not just, we hope to have this kind of impact because the, begging question is, how, and we’re not just doing this because the begging question is.
But y what is the goal? So if you have both the X and Y, I think that makes the [00:12:00] strongest, key message that you can make to the reporter. Critically to the audience you’re reaching through that reporter. Often we think the reporter is the person we’re trying to impress, we’re trying to communicate with.
but no, with the mindset that it’s not the reporter, it’s the reporter’s audience. It’s the people reading the Washington Post. It’s the people watching the Today Show. You’re, but you’re using the reporter as the medium to get to that. So that’s a little more sophisticated, but it may change your key message if you’re thinking of the ultimate goal.
Is your impact on the reporter’s audience, not just the reporter,
Michelle: right? And you, but you want the reporter to. Get that out, your message out. And I think that sometimes we get frustrated, I know as, PR professionals that sometimes the reporter doesn’t include, the piece that we most wanted them to include.
And then of course the client is unhappy or whatever. So I think, we’re gonna talk about, [00:13:00] The next question, let’s just go right to the next question. Yeah.
What can we do to help ensure our key message comes across?
Because what are ways, what are some ways that, we can, highlight, that key message in an interview so that we can never guarantee that it’s gonna come through or in the actual piece that is produced or, published, however.
What can we do to increase the odds that it will,
Joel: so, there’s this really interesting, scientific research, on this, thing called primacy and recency. And it normally applies to speeches. It says basically that the first thing you mention, this is a zone of primacy. It’s going to get attention, it’s going to be memorable because it’s not competing against any other answers or any other information.
That’s the value of primacy. Recency is the zone At the very end of your presentation or the last question in an interview, people remember that because it’s the most recent thing they heard, so it’s [00:14:00] more sticky. So if we apply that where you might even argue that has more relevance in an interview than even in a speech to the first question and the last question, what does that tell us to do?
That means that once you’ve identified that key message. You bring it out early. It’s not like a movie where you’re gonna spoil the ending if you bring out your key message too early. Or you bring it out early, and then you bring it out in the end. If it’s not a live interview, then there’s no such thing as repeating something too often.
It’ll just get clipped or cut, And you and I know if you talk to a newspaper reporter for an hour, you might. 13 words at best, publish. So they’re gonna curate it anyway. So how do you like to isolate, let say put mustard on or increase the chances that your key message will get picked?
repeat it in the primacy zone, in the recency zone and throughout. So where are mistakes made? They’re made at the beginning at primacy when A CEO might say, let’s take a look at the background. Let’s start with the history of this. [00:15:00] So now you’re spoiling that primacy zone by talking about history, not talking about your key message.
But let’s get down to brass tacks. One of the biggest questions people get asked on television is, alright, we’re almost outta time. is there anything you’d like to say to our audience, to wrap up and now whether it’s a CEO or just a spokesperson? I shouldn’t say just a spokesperson. They’re really, vital.
but often they think, all right, I said 10 things. So what’s the 11th most important thing I need to say here? That’s the mistake. They literally think, what haven’t I said and prioritized? And the super important things. What’s something else that’s less important and let’s say, vital.
Instead, what I recommend is that you just repeat and reiterate. The most important message. And you could do that simply by saying, for people who came to this interview late, and I really just want people to understand that if we do x, y will result, or I’d just like to [00:16:00] remind people that this campaign, this policy, this law is gonna have this impact if you get behind it.
we will be able to bring healthcare to many more people than who could access it before or whatever that’s going to be. So just really the bottom line is the reporter won’t come away, just like an audience won’t come away typically from saying, you made your point too often, because that’s the piece of value and honestly, that’s what the reporter wants.
Now, one other thing I’ll say here, because it’s a mistake I see often, so I’m gonna bring it up when there’s a, an interview for. A piece in the newspaper. Or, something in a publication for a magazine article. We pr people like to do the split, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, said, CEO, period, new open, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And what we do is we, and it’s neat, what we put the important part in the second chair. The non-important part in the first chair. It sometimes sounds like this. [00:17:00] I’m so proud to partner with X Company and X company, fantastic organizations on this product. Period break said CEO, Sarah, CEO.
Michelle: Yeah. Point of
Joel: this is to be like, what? why would you, again, back to primacy, why would you sabotage the very first thing they read and then put in the, in the less priority position, most important thing. So I was always scratching that. Listen, that reporter’s not gonna write about your partnerships.
That reporter, sir, couldn’t care less about how proud or excited you are. That will not appear in the soundbite. So start it with this campaign, this idea, this. new product, will, x people by showing them how, by providing this, by bringing more joy to the lives of them and their families and their pets.
use that [00:18:00] XY right there. And if your team says, we need to mention the people. Alright, then put it in the back car. we couldn’t have done this without the partnership and participation of these partners who like to see themselves in print. But you put that in the second part of the quote and the most important part.
Your key message, in the first part of the quote.
Michelle: No, I like that tip. I, although, I don’t know, it’s gonna, that’s a, hard, turn to make pivot because
Joel: I think you all so proud.
Michelle: I feel exactly like when you, I feel exactly like that when you were.
Joel: Yeah. ‘
Michelle: cause it’s just a formula that we have always used,
Joel: and we see it on LinkedIn all the time.
Whenever someone has a new book, they get a new job, they get an interview. I used to do it myself whenever I was published in an Harvard Business Review, or I’m so proud for this article, who cares? My mom is proud. You like, my mom will enjoy that. But to the [00:19:00] general audience, I’d rather do what you did as you were promoting, like even this event, here’s an issue we all talk about.
Let’s dig into it and get some answers. My guest today or I had a nice chat with, Michelle on PR explored to dive into this and reveal the ideas and the insight that’ll help us all become better communicators. then boom, you have it there with no delay and no wasted text.
Michelle: Yeah, no, I agree. ’cause I do think people’s attention span is so short and you also has to kind, grab ’em, with something interesting, not just the we are proud, we are excited, we are, that is, the other day, in fact I was writing a press release trying to figure out a different way to say, we are excited to announce some blah, blah.
it’s just.
Joel: I don’t know. And I learned, we were talking earlier, I didn’t learn this from, oh, I’m sorry my video went out, but I [00:20:00] think you can still hear me for a moment. Yes. let me just say, as I figure that out, I didn’t learn this from going into, getting a, master’s degree in communication or master’s degree in, pr.
I got this from actually being in that PR environment. being in that setting. So I learned this from the executives and the teams that I worked with.
Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. that’s the thing. I think, experience is the best teacher often. oh. Joel is not there.
Joel: Yeah, I’m trying to get into that. Let’s talk while I try to figure out.
Okay.
Michelle: no, I think that, often, it’s just we, I think it’s good to just consider different ways to do things that we’ve always done, rethinking some of these formulas that we have or these patterns that we have, [00:21:00] are good. and I think this advice is helpful in that way, and I hope you can hear me.
can you hear me? There you are. Are you okay? Yeah. Can you, did you hear what I said or not? Yeah, I did.
Joel: Sorry. This is what happens when you do a live, setting. I’m gonna try to figure it out.
Michelle: It can, yeah. it keeps taking you off the stage. I don’t know if it, it thinks that you’re not there, but I can hear you.
So I, Let’s say
Joel: it like this for now and communicate as best we can. Make sure
Michelle: that, yeah. That, that we’re, can hear each other. Okay. All right. okay.
How can executives bridge from an off-point question to an on-point message?
So the next point, I think the next question that we wanna talk about is, how to bridge, from an off point question to an on point message.
So if a reporter, asks you a question that is not, what you were anticipating, how can you [00:22:00] Move that back to, your message.
Joel: And we’ve seen, us in pr, our PR experts, we’ve seen this kind of training before we call it bridging. How do you bridge or connect from an off the point question to an on the point message?
And there are a lot of exercises and tricks, but. For me, the most important, idea to apply is this simple phrase, which is I cannot speak to that. What I can say is, and if spokespeople and CEOs only learned that, then they would find it useful or some version of that. Here’s the deal. I like to talk about the relationship between a spokesperson or a CEO and the reporter, and I think there’s an unwritten rule that the reporter.
Can only stay in the lane of expertise [00:23:00] of that person. There’s sort of an agreement there. Why would the reporter ask something that’s outside of that, and if the reporter breaks that arrangement and asks something that’s outside of the expertise or outside of the point of that communication Then the spokesperson or the CEO can say. Hey, I can’t speak to that. and if it’s not live, you could say, I can’t speak to that here, but I have people who can and I’m gonna have them get in touch with you. But if it’s live, I can’t really speak to that because that’s not what we’re focusing on.
But what I can say is, and that’s when you bridge back to the point or the key message, sometimes Michelle, we think of this key message as something new or something exclusive to pr. but we’ve encountered it. Before, in college we learned it as a thesis. In pr we learned it as a key message.
The leadership training, sometimes it’s called an elevator pitch. I like to call it, [00:24:00] a point. My wife and her fourth grade language arts class likes to call it a So what? so it’s really the idea of it. The idea is boil down. What’s the most important thing you’re trying to convey? Are you conveying it and are you conveying it in the most compelling way?
So when someone asks an off point question, your job is not to address that question. It’s really to bring it back to what you came there to do. I work with a lot of CEOs who say, if they hit me with this counterpoint, I can defend that I’m gonna be a debater and I’m gonna show them why it’s ridiculous.
And boy, I am gonna be the king debater here and get a medal for that. Maybe. No, no. That’s not where we’re, we’re in a situation where you came. To communicate a very precise message, and you need to stay on that train. don’t get off it. Even if you think you can combat that point. This is the same advice I give to speakers who take [00:25:00] q and a where someone in the q and A tries to gotcha them, with a hard question.
I could speak to that. it’s really not my subject matter expertise. What I can say is that we are trying to make it clear that X, Y, Z.
Michelle: Yeah, and I think some, again, some spokespeople seem to understand this, and if they don’t, it’s good to have, some preparation or training for them so that they can, sometimes I think here’s a scenario.
and for, and I call them nuggets, by the way I call it. Yeah. I, call it a nugget. Get back to your, Nugget. I don’t know where that came from, but somewhere along the line. but yeah. Oh, what was I gonna say? Sometimes you don’t know, like a spokesperson will say, or an executive, A CEO will say, that they have experience, talking to the media and they’ve done a lot of interviews, and then you get into an interview, [00:26:00] maybe the PR person is sitting in or what have you.
And, they realize very quickly that in fact they, the person may not have, the experience that they. Maybe said they had. So I think we have to figure out how to suggest that preparation is a good thing. And it’s, a, any person, any spokesperson could probably benefit from, some preparation if they’re.
going into an event where they might be asked some questions or they’re going into an interview of course. Or, maybe we could talk about that a little bit.
Joel: Yeah. And let’s talk about, we throw on that word preparation, like it’s understood by everybody the same way. but it really needs to be purposeful preparation.
When I was working in exec comms and we, I was working with a PR team to prepare a CEO for an interview, they would send me their key messages and often there’d be seven of them. and I’d be like, [00:27:00] there’s no way the CEO’s gonna remember seven, and by the way, you’re not indicating which one is most important.
And a lot of them were things that the CEO didn’t need to be talking so much about because they would be provided to the reporter like a history of this issue. Or how, data or percentages about this issue. so how can we boil that down so that the spokesperson or the CEO can understand them?
And by the way, this is where I wanna bring in this, this thing that PR teams do, that’s really a waste of time, which is scripting out answers to questions. So they wordsmith it. They use ai, they use Grammarly, whatever, all their tools, as if this was going to be printed as qa. And they hand that to the CEO.
And what is the CEO supposed to do with that? Memorize it. you have a lot of thes and ands and periods and, colons and semi, like what is the point of [00:28:00] scripting out answers to questions. If you do that, you’re really saying, we want the spokesperson to memorize this. And you never wanna say that, because that ruins authenticity.
But if there’s one idea, Michelle, I really wanted to put out there, ’cause I see this often, I don’t hear about it a lot. Spokesperson spokespeople and CEOs, especially from nonprofits, often spend a lot of their time conveying key points that are about the problem, but not the solution. And I have this, I see this problem in op-eds all the time.
A lot of time is spent on, alright, here’s the data on how many people are affected. Here’s how they are suffering, here’s how our planet is being over polluted doom and doom and doom. We’re in trouble. People are, their rights are being taken away. Three minutes, four minutes, and then finally, but our nonprofit has the solution.
Now what have you done? You’ve buried your key [00:29:00] point, which is about, remember the XY, our nonprofit is gonna use X tool to achieve Y result. You’ve buried it under minutes and words and paragraphs of description of the problem. I wrote an article about this.
At the end of the day, these CEO and spokespeople, they are not. Problem Describers, that’s not the business you’re in. You are in the problem solution business. So you need to rework a lot of those communications so that you lead with the solution. And that makes be difficult because often we need to describe the problem.
But the way we get around that is we have a broad statement of the problem. Many people are suffering. And what our mission is, to, relieve that suffering by this. Now let’s dive into what the problem is. But I brought out my solution early and I, in an op-ed, I would even say, this is a big problem, but one [00:30:00] of the ways we can solve this problem is through X, Y, Z.
Let’s look at each of the sub-issues in this problem and the ways this answer is going to solve it. So now you have problem, solution, problem, solution, problem. The bottom line is every way I can. I wanna make sure the spokesperson or the CEO is leading with the solution to the problem, thus the mission of the organization, not a mere description of that problem or an inventory of that problem.
Michelle: this is great because here’s something that happens, I find often is that I feel like, Companies want to get everything in. They wanna jam everything into a press release. They wanna get everything into an interview. They, I don’t know if they fear that they won’t have another opportunity to talk about these things, or that if the reporter needs more information, they won’t ask for it.
But I think by trying to jam everything in, we are actually diluting our key message. Is [00:31:00] that right?
Joel: Yeah. This, is something I say. And I put a lot of mustard on. I reinforce it in my presentation training because what happens when people get a lot of information and a lot of details all at once, sometimes we think, oh, it’s like a Christmas tree.
The more ornaments we hang on it, the more it’ll glow. But no, what’s happening in their brains, in their cognitive process? All of those ideas are fighting each other for attention, especially to a reporter who’s not taking copious notes or recording it or using an AI assistant. So as a result of all those ideas fighting each other for attention, the impact of each is diluted and less memorable.
So we, we all know that less is more. we don’t always know that more is less. And something I like to say is that if I tell you a lot of things, you’ll remember none of them. If I tell you some things, you’ll remember some of them. If I tell you [00:32:00] one thing. You will remember all of them. So try to stick to one big idea, again, pushing the likelihood that the reporter will highlight that idea or use it, as the, statement from you, or at least one idea at, time.
So that will sound like this. first I wanna talk about how this affects our community. And you go on about that. but I also wanna talk about how this affects the, world. In fact, this will have international impacts and then you talk about that. But I made a strong different, differentiation and delineation between my first point and my second point and much, very importantly, I put them in the order of priority.
I just, met with some of my fifth graders yesterday and they’re putting together speeches and we call it, what’s your big idea? Reason one, [00:33:00] reason two, reason three. So they filled in these boxes for reason one, reason two, reason three, which we may know as a key message, one, two, and three.
But very often they were in random. Their number three was the most powerful ’cause They didn’t know that they should lead with the most important one. Then the second most important because of the primacy and rec, the primacy and recency we discussed. So we reorder it and I say to them, what do you most want people to remember?
this detail about how fireworks can, cause injuries. Or this point about how fireworks are very expensive and people shouldn’t waste their money. That’s a real, actually, it’s a real example. And then they say, oh, obviously how it causes injury. I said, alright, maybe we should move that to the first reason and then move the other point about it being expensive to your third reason.
Michelle: Yeah. And that, that’s, I think I’ve also heard instead of, one message, [00:34:00] maybe you want three or what are the three most important things if you’re writing a press release? But now I feel like that again is, even if you do that, you still need to have the prioritization.
’cause you really wanna.
Joel: If the reporter’s only gonna choose one.
Michelle: Yeah. So I
Joel: think that’s where the opportunities for reiteration for, reinforcing at the end. And something I say, Michelle in presentation, which I think is really important for interviews as well, is when you tell a story. We’re all about storytelling and examples and case studies.
We love them. PR people like push those stories to their CEOs to make sure they tell them all the time. ’cause people love hearing stories. The problem is the stories do not sell themselves. and if you watch a TED Talk, they tell a lot of stories, but they always end the stories with. And here are the key words.
I call them the magic words. This story illustrates why we should. This story is a great [00:35:00] example of what happens when we, this story really proves that if we apply X, we’ll achieve y. I would even say that’s where the true value is, and that’s where the quote is. You know what a reporter would do, will say, the CEO EO told the story of a client who went through this, and then they’re gonna quote the CEO not telling the story, but saying this story really illustrates, the powerful impact of our mission.
Or the loyalty that people have to Coca-Cola, whatever it is. I don’t mean to say, everyone needs to be saving the world. but those words are so important and should be trained in media training. This illustrates why this proves that. this is a great example of what happens when we.
Michelle: Yeah, I think the examples are really important, when you’re speaking and, yeah, it’s sometimes, again, [00:36:00] I think people tell a story and they don’t have a point, so it’s important to think. think through it. Even if you don’t have a resource to help you prepare and you don’t maybe have a, someone to help you with media training or preparation as a spokesperson or an executive, somebody speaking on behalf of a company or organization.
You can always take a few minutes to think through, these things and. think about it. There’s so many things to think about, But you’ve gotta think about it, not only from your perspective, but also what you are trying to convey to your audience. And then if the reporter, is part of the equation, what are they most likely gonna take away?
So right. Things to think about.
Joel: And if your, if your job is to reinforce the key message as much as possible with the idea that if they hear it more often or show it illustrated more often, they’re more likely to write it down. This is another avenue to do it. So if you don’t [00:37:00] wanna say the same phrase over and over again, then when you tell stories, end your story with that key message and your examples and your case studies.
With that key message, so the, even the reporter understands this isn’t just a story to be entertaining, or this isn’t just a story around the theme of, healthcare. this is a story that illustrates, what this organization and what this executive is trying to do.
Michelle: Yes. I, sometimes wonder what do you, how, what is your stance on, okay, so I, bring up that, example about the Kellogg’s, CEOA lot talking about, he got caught off guard and he said something about, if people are struggling financially, they should eat cereal for dinner.
And I just, that, that story was just so incredible to me. However, I would like to think about deconstruct, how did he get to that point, instead of. He got asked a question on the [00:38:00] fly, off the cuff. Could, what could he, how could he have done handled that differently? Could he just. what else?
There are other ways he could have handled it.
Joel: Yeah. I think the CEO lost their sense of purpose, and that needs to be tattooed on their head. Everything coming out of your mouth should support this key message. Because it’s, yes, you wanna be conversational with the reporter. But at the end of the day, the point isn’t conversation.
don’t worry so much about your authenticity that you’re going to allow yourself to say a bunch of things off the cuff. if you have a personality, it’s going to come out as long as you’re not scripted. If you’re not scripted, then I think you’ll come across as human. Then the next thing to really worry about is, everything I’m saying, whether through imagery.
Whether through example, whether through direct [00:39:00] language, whether through a joke, whether through an off the cuff, is it supporting that, that key message? ’cause something, I’m sure you say and PR specialists say all the time, everything is on the record, everything coming outta your mouth. Yes. And if you say something hot, yes, that’s what will be there.
Michelle: Reporters love. they love these soundbites. Reporters love it. Yeah, sure. It’s not good for the, company, it’s not good for the organization, and it’s not good for the spokesperson if they put their foot in their mouth. and it’s certainly not good for the PR team.
Joel: It has to
Michelle: play a cleanup crew there.
Joel: if we think about roles, we talked about thinking about your audience as the reporter, but also thinking about your audience as the audience of that reporter. That reporter can have split priorities. There can be a priority to illuminate the. Into that CEO or illuminate them into the purpose of the organization’s mission.
But they could also be [00:40:00] thinking, Hey, maybe there’s something juicy here that I can get a bunch of eyeballs to my article and then have a bunch of self-serving purposes. That may be the case. but to the audience, they won’t have that selfs serving. purpose. So try to make the most of the purpose of the audience and that sec, that other purpose of the reporter by staying on point.
Yes, you should be friendly. Yes, you just should smile. Yes, you want them to be your friend. but first and foremost, you want them to highlight, to capture, to reinforce, and to. publish the, key message.
Michelle: What
Joel: are you doing? Why, what impact will it have?
Michelle: Yeah. and it’s not easy. Let’s be clear.
they we’re asking a lot of these, of spokespeople and executives that are put in this position. So we know it’s not easy, it’s just these are just, this is just advice and tips that could help you, [00:41:00] improve your, media relations game a little bit. yeah, but
Joel: I wanna say Michelle, in media training.
One of the ways I’ve seen it done poorly is, alright, we’re gonna give you a bunch of it. We’re gonna lecture at you for an hour and then we’re gonna put you in front of the camera and then we’re gonna criticize you for the last half hour. first of all, in the lecture, we know from adult learning that people learn most poorly from lectures.
they learn best from interaction. They learn best from teaching each other. These advices. So when I do media training, within the first 10 or 15 minutes, we have an exercise where we talk only about points. I don’t care about the six questions. I care only about the one question. Why are you here today?
Let’s answer that and let’s move on. Let’s spend an, 45 minutes on why are you here today? Let’s nail that. Because if you goof up that part, then that’s the ball game right there. Only then do we then practice with, all right. Here are some follow-up questions. Here are more questions, [00:42:00] but everyone around the room, all six people or 16 people in that media training have to be able to articulate.
The key message alone and in isolation before we even move on to more questions. ’cause if you hit them with a bunch of more ideas and here’s about volume, here’s about eye contact, here’s where to look, here’s how to dress. They’re gonna forget that key message and be thinking about that other things.
And then when you finally get to the, the exercises, the feedback, they’re gonna forget the important parts and they’re gonna be thinking about how white their teeth are.
Michelle: I laugh because you’re just everything you say is so true.
Oh, dear. how about, can I ask you about email interviews?
Joel: Sure. Sure.
How can spokespeople communicate effectively in email interviews?
Michelle: A lot of course. two things. So, email interviews are popular with clients. I often encourage clients to do the phone interview or the [00:43:00] Zoom interview because I feel like, the reporter’s gonna get better quotes usually.
And also I just, I feel like it’s a relationship building, exercise. It’s an opportunity. but a lot of clients want to. Goop for the email response. and that can be a little bit dry sometimes. And then I see also reporters in some cases are moving away from that because they are afraid it is gonna be all AI generated and they don’t want that.
’cause they don’t want just. Publish that. And it sounds like everyone else, it’s really not good for anyone, to be honest, to use AI to generate your responses to, reporters’ questions. But that’s not our topic today, but,
Joel: the thing about ai, I’m just gonna take that offroad for a moment, the key words there are what you said, Michelle, we shouldn’t have e ai, AI generate, we can have AI review, improve, [00:44:00] proofread to make sure, but the bigger point I wanna make is that the AI problem predates ai.
there’s always been a problem with executive quotes that are emailed in sounding like boiler plate. That is a word that we need to, bring back into the modern frame. How can we make quotations not sound like boilerplate? And when you have an email interview, yeah. You can use ai, you can use your communications team.
They could draft it for you and you could say approved. they can just take the boilerplate from press releases that the, there are a bunch of perils to that. Sometimes the reporter cares, sometimes they don’t. But if you want to retain the authenticity and the humanness and the humanity of these quotes I would suggest often making it about a feeling and using a lot of, I we. Language, often we, felt so right away, boom. I have a, we and I have a feeling language. We [00:45:00] felt that something needed to be done about X. So we spoke to this many people and we, created a program that will solve that problem.
so now I’m making it more personal. versus talking third person, XXX corporation, which is your corporation. So it should be a, we, the X XX Corporation developed such and such, from afar. So I would take those two keywords. One, the feeling that inspired that solution, and two, using I and we language, I don’t mind I language here, ’cause you are interviewing the CEO for a general spokesperson.
They probably shouldn’t use I language so much, but the CEO is the embodiment of the mission. And so when the CEO says I, they’re talking about their leadership style, their leadership approach, [00:46:00] their executive presence, if you will. and they’re infusing the quote with that. So I, but just make sure it sounds collaborative.
I worked with my team to make sure we stayed focused on this problem and we have developed a new pharmaceutical. To help people who are suffering from it, because that suffering is, something that needs to end. the other thing I would end is a colleague of mine used to use the phrase weekend words.
don’t use big words. You’re not trying to impress people and you don’t impress people anymore with big words. Often AI will have the big words, so break it down and use that old rule. Would this make sense to a fifth grader or a sixth grader? If you do, you make it less taxing for the person reading it and reporters appreciate it.
So keep it simple. keep it personal. I, we, and talk about, feelings, not just issues.
Michelle: And stay away from acronyms.
Joel: Absolutely, [00:47:00] Even for people, you know what, people often take that advice and they think, I’m gonna use the acronyms with my people ’cause they know what the acronyms mean.
But here’s the thing. Acronyms. Acronyms are taxing on people’s brains. Even if they know them, they have to decode them in their heads. Yeah. So that’s a cognitive step they need to take that they wouldn’t have to if you just explained it.
Michelle: Yeah, exactly. At least the first time you, say it or first reference and written.
yeah,
Joel: a hundred percent. I’m, I had a client who’s actually speaking tomorrow at a big conference about a big issue, and I don’t wanna name the issue, but there’s a phrase that’s associated with the issue, or let’s call it, food insecurity. Let’s take that for a moment. we’re gonna talk today about food insecurity.
They go and they never define food insecurity. And some people, first of all, that’s not a very personal phrase. Food insecurity, there’s no people in it. the word hunger isn’t even in it. the word suffering [00:48:00] isn’t even in it. The word privilege isn’t in it. It’s just this sort of very technical, very unemotional phrase.
So one of the first things I did with this, president of this nonprofit was the first time she mentioned it, and I’m using just again, food insecurity as an example. She would say, we really need to tackle food insecurity, which is the unavailability or the lack of resources and f money people have.
To afford something as basic as food, that’s what people need to hear. That’s what they respond to. So the bottom line is everyone in the audience knows what food insecurity is, but you do yourself a favor about breaking it down to its most simple elements that even a fourth grader can understand and bringing in those human element, elements, people hunger, suffering, that is gonna be so much more powerful than those very useful two words, food insecurity.
Good. Good
Michelle: [00:49:00] point.
Joel: Thank you.
Michelle: Yeah, not everybody always knows what you’re talking about. Even if you think they don’t always know, and I see it almost every day. I see it somewhere and I’m just like, it’s so frustrating to me. It’s
Joel: flu. I’ll just say that. We went through a whole media training with her.
We met for two times, and it was only in our third or fourth meeting where I looked at her and I said, We never define this term and we can figure it out intellectually. But I think you need to do that sort of at the start. Let’s break this down, not only to define it, but to explain it in human impact terms, which will be compelling, which will move to move people.
Michelle, something I like to say about public speaking training is that if you nail this speech. Just if you nail this interview, what is the audience going to do? We often say impact. It’ll impact the audience, but impact is what I call a adjective. It’s like a word that’s so broad, it could mean [00:50:00] almost anything.
We have, we get impacted by great desserts at dinner. so what do when we say impact and actually borrowed this from a client I used to work with. When you nail that interview, the people who listen to it or read it later will think. Feel or do something different, they will feel, think, or do something as a result of that communication or interview.
And that’s a wonderful standard to have. It’s not unrealistic, but it really gives you a northern light or a northern star for what you’re trying to do. Will this quote, will this interview, will this speech, move people to feel. Think or do?
Michelle: Yes. Because we want them to, act on, our words,
Joel: not just be like, wow, what a great spokesperson.
That’s the mistake often too. I have PR [00:51:00] people who are like, oh, that CEO did such a good job. They were funny and they were interesting, and they were knowledgeable and they were charismatic. and the reporters seemed to love talking to them, and someone asked, yeah, all that is true. But what was conveyed to the audience?
what should they do? I don’t remember. They never really put a URL on the screen, and I think in the middle of the CEO, something said about how they can get involved. But man, was that CEO So interesting. you and I know, and your audience, they don’t hand out medals for great interviews, right?
You only measure an interview by the level of action. It inspired someone to take.
Michelle: Yeah. and I feel there’s, some really want to, get better and they do, they can improve, right? it’s, again, you’re not, it’s not [00:52:00] like you fell out of bed knowing how to do these things.
It’s something that you work on over time. It’s a process. And the more you do it, the more you exercise that muscle, the better you’ll get at doing it. So I think, that’s something too. and it’s, hard because I know a lot of times our ego’s involved and we don’t wanna be critical and we don’t wanna, we kind of wanna encourage, while also.
Providing constructive feedback.
Joel: Yeah, it is. And then, you raised two really important points there. One is, it is a skill, not a talent, which means we all like to think people are born with it to be great. But everyone’s, Michelle was born a great public speaker. no, she has staff. She learned, she saw, and everyone did.
You, Michelle and I and anyone who’s done media training, we have seen it with our own eyes moving someone who’s rambling, to moving someone who’s a great point maker because they just never realized that there was a point to make. So I think that’s something that’s [00:53:00] really important and you should lean on that support, and get training and get the kind of training.
That makes you think about what your point is. A lot of times in media training, if it’s in-house, we have the clients, if we call them that, work together with their PR counterpoint to come up with key messages even before the media training. So you don’t have to spend the media training developing key messages.
You only use the media training on how to convey, key messages. And like I always say with, speech practice, the. The act of communicating a key message involves two things. Your mind and your mouth, not just either one. Your mouth can say it, but your mouth is dumb. It doesn’t know what to say.
Your mind knows what to say, but it’s mute. It doesn’t have the ability to say it. So what I’m saying is people need to practice immediate training saying those key points. In real time spontaneously without looking at a script so they could [00:54:00] practice having their mind and their mouth work together to produce that result.
Michelle: Yes. It’s not easy. And again, I think, as somebody who is not a natural, public speaker, it does it. you have the nerves, that’s okay. You feel the nerves feel the fear and you do it anyway. And the preparation is what helps give you, confidence and, you like I said, you do feel like you, you improve maybe a little bit each time, and that’s really what you’re, going for.
And even if you’ve been doing it a long time, there probably. Tweaks you can make, depending on what it is. And we have a question that I think is perfect, for this because the different mediums, probably require different coaching. Would you say? the question I’ll read it. he asked, I’m curious how you coach spokespeople to be on camera in different channels.
Like t as TV news is different than Instagram or TikTok. [00:55:00] is, that’s what he’s saying. So
Joel: yeah, I would say that for the most part, I don’t. Okay. I. Teach people, and I suggest that you need to develop your point and then customize the icing on that cake, which is your point for those different channels.
Instagram, TikTok, TV news, a conference keynote. These are environments, that you need to pay attention to the rules for, but you don’t have different. Key points based on your environment, you will have different key points based on an audience. Why did that audience come here? What do they want and need to know?
but you shouldn’t change your purpose or your point merely because you’re giving it in a different environment. You’re giving too much, control to that environment, and you’re putting [00:56:00] too much sabo potential sabotage into your. Point. Some people have said to me, if I use a tiny voice, then people will listen to it more.
Or I’ll sound less like a public speaker and I say, no. That’s the one thing I could do without video is to do the different voices. but I say no. I have found that energy and volume gets people’s attention. puts more mustard on your point, makes you sound more like a subject matter expert. More like a leader, more authoritative, more credible, more competent, more confident.
I talk a lot about confidence and how. More energy and a stronger volume actually build your confidence whether you are confident or not. So yeah, I’m gonna push back a little bit and just say, tailor yourself to the environment. I do for example, zoom training where I talk about things like backgrounds and filling that space and how [00:57:00] that conveys presence and messaging.
And it does, but the message itself, shouldn’t change dramatically.
Michelle: Yeah, no, that’s, I like that answer and I’m, it was a little bit unexpected, although I, it makes sense to me because, at the end of the day, if your point is your point, yes, of course. Sometimes it has to be more succinct if you’re, if you are doing, a very brief, video or something like that versus a 45 minute presentation.
But, I, it’s, at the end of the day, it’s the same. Point.
Joel: Yeah. And remember, primacy and recency, if you’re talking for two minutes, primacy is in the first 30 seconds and the last 30 seconds if you’re giving a 10 minute speech, primacy is in the first minute and the last minute. And if you miss some of this podcast, these are the two zones where people are most interested.
In the beginning, that’s called primacy because it’s not competing against any other information. And in the end that’s called recency. It’s [00:58:00] memorable because it’s the most recent thing you said. Now, you may just be an influencer. I shouldn’t say just, you may be an influencer. I don’t wanna be
Michelle: just an influencer.
Joel: You may be an influencer who’s just trying to get likes and become a celebrity. And listen, if that’s your goal, then that’s your goal, but you also have a point, my. What I want people to know is that listening to me can help them find great food at great prices. so you still have a point to make.
It’s just a little different for your purpose, and your purpose should be tied to your point. But yeah, don’t go thinking. I a don’t, as a speaker or as a, it’s trying to celebritize yourself. Don’t be thinking you have to be on every single channel out there and don’t be thinking you have to say something different for each of those channels.
You just have to customize for that environment.
Wrapping up executive communications advice with Joel Schwartzberg
Michelle: That is great advice and, we are going to [00:59:00] wrap it up. and I just can’t thank you enough for being here today, Joel. I’ve been a real pleasure and I, just, everything that you said resonated. I, can’t wait to go back and take notes for myself. And
Joel: right now you don’t have to watch.
You can just listen and, Less multitasking.
Michelle: and, again, I just wanna thank you so much for everything that you shared for spending time today. and it was just a pleasure. So thank you.
Joel: Thank you, Michelle. I appreciate the opportunity
Michelle: and I’ll be back in two weeks with my guest Brooke Sellas and we’ll be talking about, social media and PR and how to handle maybe a social media crisis that might crop up.
we’ll, get into that a little bit. So I’ll see you in two weeks and thanks so much.
About the host: Michelle Garrett is a B2B PR consultant, media relations consultant, and author of B2B PR That Gets Results, an Amazon Best Seller. She helps companies create content, earn media coverage, and position themselves as thought leaders in their industry. Michelle’s articles have been featured by Entrepreneur, Content Marketing Institute, Muck Rack, and Ragan’s PR Daily, among others. She’s a frequent speaker on public relations and content. Michelle has been repeatedly ranked among the top ten most influential PR professionals.
Learn more about Michelle’s freelance PR consulting services here. Book a no-obligation call to talk about your needs here. Buy Michelle’s book here.
